Listen up, everyone important warning for this episode. As I've emphasized before you should never do breathing exercises in water or before training in water. So you should not use the Wim Hof method without proper supervision. A and B, never do it. Proceeding training in water, or in water shallow, water blackouts can be fatal, and I've seen some very, very scary accidents in the past including very close friend, who recently remained unconscious under water at a public pool for
Almost 4 minutes and remained unconscious for 20 minutes. He has a small son could have died in the process. Do not make that mistake with all that said, please enjoy. So I'm recording. Could you just tell me maybe what you had for
breakfast? Yeah, nothing. I had nothing for breakfast. I never eat
breakfast. Okay, all right. Yeah, it just once a day. All right, we're going to talk about that for sure. Let me just pause this optimal altitude. I can on flat out for a half mile before.
And start shaking the miles you a personal question. Now it's a cybernetic organism living tissue over metal endoskeleton.
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Why? Hello, lemurs and leprechauns. This is Tim Ferriss and welcome to another episode of the Tim Ferriss show where it is. My job to deconstruct world-class performers, whether they are actors like Arnold Schwarzenegger, military strategists or generals, like Stanley, McChrystal chess Prodigy is like Josh waitzkin or in this particular case, a miracle worker of sorts. In fact, you could say, he is a daredevil women Hoff otherwise known as The Iceman is a Dutch world record, holder Adventurer, certainly Daredevil and he's nicknamed The Iceman.
For his ability to withstand extreme cold, his creator of the Wim Hof method, and holds more than 20 World Records. He is in my mind, the outlier of outliers not because he does so many absurd things and proves that these Impossibles are, in fact possible. But he routinely asked scientists to scrutinize and validate these Feats. That's what makes him very, very unique and very interesting for this type of conversation. What are some of his feet swell in 2070 climb path. The death zone altitude on Mount
Everest which is around 7,500 meters, wearing nothing but shorts 2009. He completed a full Marathon above, the polar Circle and Finland in temperatures, close to negative, 20 degrees Celsius again dressed in nothing. But shorts, he holds the Guinness world record for the longest ice bath, which is around at one hour, 53 minutes and 12 seconds but it's not just cold. He has run full marathons in the Namib Desert without any water. He is also had toxins injected into himself under a doctor's supervision and demonstrate that he can effectively control his autonomic.
In response, this is crazy talk. These are things that fly in the face of many textbooks, and now he is featured in textbooks himself because he has documented all this and it's not just a whim specialty. He is not a mutant. He is able to train others to achieve many of these same effects and abilities in some cases with just four days of training. So we'll dig into all this and more. I love this conversation. He is a human guinea pig of human guinea pigs. Certainly and makes me feel like an amateur so with that
That further Ado, please enjoy my conversation with Wim Hof.
Welcome to the show with. I'm so pleased to have you
great. Thank you for welcoming me this way. Thank you very much.
I've been a fan for quite a few years because we have as we mentioned before we started recording, mutual friend in Ray Krone eyes and he was in my second book. So I looked very closely at Cold exposure and of course you the Iceman came up over and over again, so it's really nice to finally chat with you. It's
Like it's been a long time coming and also had to pass guests or three past guests on this podcast, Laird Hamilton and Brian Mackenzie. And also Gabby Reece Laird's wife, who are big fans of your methods and techniques we've been practicing. So they are you have a lot a lot of fans out there. I'm sure listening as well and I thought we could just start with your name. I've always loved. Your name is when your full name.
Yeah, you are.
I am win
in desert. It doesn't have any particular meaning, or how did your parents choose that name.
Fame, is a common name and in Holland in the Netherlands at, but I looked it up and it says it's the protector of the people. You know, any name is, got some etymological roots to it. My name is the protector of people. My brother's name. Who was a, my twin brother is a
Dre, Andre en Francais. Andrei, Andrew like Andrew, he is the protector of goods, so who's better? I don't know.
I see especially both he did. Yeah. It's a protection, right? And you have such a fascinating story and you have a lot of accolades, a lot of Records, I think more than 20 world records at this point. It seems what was the first world record that you said?
The first was in Paris just staying half-hour in immersed and eyes and 12 days later. I repeated the racket time and make it made it an hour in
Hollywood actually. Yes. And I saw one also mean, you've been, you spend a lot of time in ice baths and I've largely influenced by you and a handful of other people, Tim know.
Ray and a huge fan of ice baths. In my fans, always complain about it. But I've seen you in so many containers full of eyes, I saw one where it looks like there is a lot of Chinese or Japanese in the background. What is the what has been the most challenging cold exposure experience that you've had whether it's for records or anything
else? Maybe losing my sight while I was swimming underneath a eyes deck of almost
One meter, I had no goggles on. So Allah side at 35 meters something like 40 yards and I lost the whole and yeah I think it's like that shit happens. It happened over there right at me to eyes that be above me so yeah that was some great experience. Another one was losing my way on my own.
Everest in shorts, and at the, like, 18,000 feet in, in a blizzard in the, like a wideout, so things like that happen. Yeah. And
yeah.
Challenging but then it throws me back to, you know, the depth of myself to and which is trust and confidence in and I got it.
What do you say to yourself in one of those moments? So, if I guess physiologically did your, did your retinas?
Has just freeze or when you were swimming under the ice deck in a moment like that when many people would panic. I mean, did you panic? If so, how what was the mental self talk? When you realize that was happening?
Very interesting. It is the stress level at the, at that moment is absent is not there. I'm just dealing with the situation and it has been shown in the University that our stress levels the stress.
Mold levels are able to be raised lying in bed, more than somebody in fear. For the first time, going into a bunker jump.
O goes about doing a bungee jump for the first time.
Yeah. Yeah. But not me by because the bungee jump. Yeah you you are attached but very unexpected situations in nature like a blizzard or
swimming beneath her eyes and
And losing
the whole because your eyesight is gone, things like that or climbing without gear, steep mountains, and having cramps. And what do you do at that moment? And that's exactly what I learned, how to raise consciously, the stress hormone level purely controlled, and I'm able to deal with the situation at that moment without panicking.
And I think that's one of the crucial findings, which could benefit for human mankind, as it is, you know, very subjected to stress all the time, panicking and having fear and all that. And I learned in nature how to deal with that and call brought me, brought me that signs brought me that knowledge wisdom
actually and the the raising of stress hormones. So to
Rolling. Something that has long been thought to be part of the autonomous nervous system. Something that you have no control over, right? And we'll get to the breathing because breathing is very interesting since it's both autonomous. But you can you can consciously control it and practice different methods. I think it was it was certainly in the vice documentary that recently came out which I recommend to everyone, and I'll link to in the show notes, but was it in 2011 that you were injected with some type of virus or bacteria to cycle? You could control the immune response that was
The Dutch, I'm gonna mispronounce this, the Redbud University.
Exactly wrap out to University and Holland and the intensive care and nuclear science. I underwent a an experiment and they injected me with a endotoxin with that talk seen actually, which is a part of a bacteria and that creates a very dramatic, immune response. And as we have
No control over the immune response in our body. They thought I was not able to do it as well as expected because nobody showed to be able to surpress the immune response because it is part of the autonomic nervous system and nobody is able to do that. Until now, I showed that I was very able within a quarter of our instead of ours.
Suffering from uncontrolled, shivering, fever, headaches, and all that. I shall within a quarter of our to have control complete over the symptoms. And also the cytokines, which is a which are the flam ettore beings in the blood created by the immune response and I showed in the blood and by Blood results, to suppress them dramatically within a quarter.
And then they told me, okay? But you are an exception that confirms the rule because yeah, you have been training so many years. You are guys, man, you do exceptional features but nobody is able to do that without that. Proper training of so many years and I told them, no, I can train them within 10 days and that the professor was really
Because if this group would show to be able within 10 days, to be able to influence deeply into the atomic nervous system related to the immune system, then that's for the first time in the scientific history. So buddy, he saw the indication of the possibility but still thought those guys are not going to be able to do
Ooh, that within 10 days and you know what, it wasn't within 10 days, it wasn't with four days of training that I made them able to undergo the same experiment that that means that the injection of the endotoxin and have them within a quarter of our completely control over their immune system, related to the autonomic nervous system. So they showed a
Hundred percent School of everybody to be able within a couple of days to go in to tap into the autonomous nervous system related to the immune system. And yeah, and the training about to trading be a prior to it, we had a business, you know, in the evening and there's a lot of music and very relaxed and their mindset. I said,
hey guys, probably you, you guys are the new Gladiators. Well, we are going to win the worst war ever, which produced the much the most casualties Agony, pain and all that, and that's the bacteria that's the back. So that's the virus and we gonna win this war. Are you with me? That's the
I talked to them and so they had a mindset. So in the evening we had a relaxed and it was like a hippie movement, but this is a new Revolution. And in four days time they were able at the fourth day without prior experience in the cold. They were able to go in short at bye-bye - Stan. That's about I don't know, in Paris.
My selfies. This is selfish means freezing cold.
Yeah, it's probably in the 20s probably in,
yes, intertwine below freezing. Yeah, and then for hours and hours, we were going uphill and up to Mountain and we arrived at the summit after hours. And it was - 27 - 27 Celsius that is that is more than - and then 20s, it's probably 10.
Something like that and we dance the Harlem Shake. Open up there. Then I knew These Guys these guys are ready in four days time when they will be internalized in the in the hospital and injected with the endotoxin, they will be able because I feel when somebody is back into its natural state of his or hers physiology and I
I know how to do that. The cold trade, me, they've called, as my teacher
and with the with these subjects, I'm so curious to ask because the, I mean, I am, certainly not as proficient as you are in any of these techniques. But I've enjoyed experimenting over the last 10 years and writing about these short experiments whether it's related to breath-holding with David Blaine or or other aspects obviously you're a professional and I am not but I'm so I be
Very curious to hear you perhaps elaborate for instance on the first day of training with these subjects before in preparation to be injected four days later. Sure what did the first day of training? Look like for them
and just in the morning at East at 8 o'clock, without food intake. We do breathing and they lie on the ground. All because that's the most relaxed post.
And if you are relaxed, you're able to store up all mode, all lot more oxygen than when intention or in post you. So I say, it'll just lay down and relax.
Now, we are going to begin.
Just breathe in deeply and let go breathe in deeply. Let go make it a rhythm. Breathe in deeply. Let go not fully out, but fully in
And let go and repeat that about 30 40 times until this indications or symptoms coming by. And that it means lightheadedness
Loosen the body feeling loose in the body tingling contractions. That's because carbon dioxide goes out. Oxygen is roaming freely throughout the body and the pH levels rice. They are optimal aged so they get to their best condition. And that's proven, that's proven and they. So when we do this,
They so they saw all these results chemically. Then once you feel positively, charged with all these symptoms of lightheadedness feeling loose contractions and tingling in the body, as them just breathe in deeply. Let go. And now the last time breathe in deeply, let go, and after letting go after exhalation, stop.
Reframe from breathing hers? No need we got a whole lot of oxygen and measurement devices are not able to detect how much it's more than a hundred percent. That's my opinion. But device still are not able to detect that they only can go up to a hundred percent as they say. But the hundred percent their body is able to store up more oxygen than measurement devices of
Now are able to measure. So then after 1/2 minute, then you see that the measurement device shows, a hundred percent, and then it goes dramatically down afterwards,
and you're using a pulse oximeter, like something that you clip on your yeah.
Yes, Paul's exam. So you need a heart beat, you have a heartbeat and you have the saturation of the oxygen in inside the blood.
So the amount of oxygen. So, after 1/2 mini GC with everybody that the saturation of the blood is going down a, you know, people with COPD that that's lung diseases and all that they, they suffer from real severe COPD. When they have 85, we go to 90 to 80 70, 60, 50 people, died at 50 and 40, 40,
Percent saturation in the blood, we go past, we get who go even to 30 and then the device measurement device, the accumulator shuts down, it is not measuring anymore, but we even go
past that one now. Why don't you, why don't the subjects pass out at this
point? They don't pass out because they are
alkaline. I see
there. The pH degrees are really perfect that
That moment and instead of a person who is dying is very acidic. So that's the difference. So because we have so alkaline people, maybe sometimes are able to pass out, but just two seconds or three seconds because they get, they are out of their conditioned control but in a, you know, after exercising, they have
Regain not only control in those moments and and those situations, they they win a new part in the brain. They get in a very deep in the brain, and it's all new terrain, it's like baby. A baby has no problem with, with her legs, but there are no motoric mature Oracle neurons to the legs. Yet ready, tap? So we are going to different parts of the brain.
Where there is where the guy or the girl that has been, right? So it's logic that the people are able to pass out, but nothing happens because they are alkaline. So they just wake up and mostly almost you almost always, they wake up very happy and it's like a drug experience. So, but that's besides of the real
Fact, I'm trying to not not try which we showed scientifically is to be able to tap into the immune system, in all the layers, those are three layers and normally we are not able to get into the second and the third layer. And I say now we have found a key to the second and the third and third layer. That means the nonspecific
in system and the specific adaptive immune system. And that makes us looking to disease completely different because our ability so much more and we have been publishing people in Boston. They published it throughout America on the University's chapter, 22 on biology. Now, and it tells that we have tapped into the atomic
The system into the N8 innate immune system, which was up till now not possible. And we did at a hundred percent with a group of nine, people showing that they were very able to do it all of them within a quarter of an hour and have spectacular results. So that it is Signs Now and now it needs to get to every person in the world.
How to tap into the deeper layers of our physiology without training, you know, years and years and years and being Yogi's or being the super athletes and all that. Know, my Amos within a couple of days, we are all able to tap into the deepest layers of our physiology and reset our immune system. Bring it under our will
And that's my aim but then we make fun too. And all that, but for sale being serious,
that's my goal right now is just going to say. I mean it's very hard to get the, I think you're approaching it in a very intelligent way because it's very hard to get truly serious work done. If you're serious all the time. So yeah, I enjoy. It's very fascinating for me as a teacher to watch how you coach your subjects because you use
Are you have guitar? And I think it's very important component, it would seem seem to be and I wanted to ask you about the breathing on day one. Just one more time, which is yes, is, is the breathing exercises on day? One. Something that then the subjects use during the injection or before the injection or is it an exercise to prove to them that they can do more than they think they can do and it's more of a confidence Builder that you use to.
Set the tone for the rest of the training.
Yes. Whoa. So it's a confidence Builder and is very effective at the moment when something like an injection is coming and they know it will result in dramatic immune response and they have to build up and make alert their Shield or their particular protective lines of Defense, which is the immune system.
Yes, so both,
whoa, and is this something that you can do after the fact? So, for instance, at this point, with your, your level of proficiency, if you were to contract a disease without realizing it and then to get very sick, would you be able to reverse that? Or is it something that needs to be? Is that it does? The shield need to be activated before hand in order for you to control that autonomous so-called
Honest response.
Interesting. Very nice. It's both preventive and healing. So once a specific hormone or molecule must be generated to get to a an Invader and non-self Invader in the body, which could be a bacteria, a virus, or a back cell, which got through the first two lines of Defense.
And then the third line is more specific, but it takes normally like weeks or sometimes it's not traceable because an Invader is mutating, but we have now a method that is able to tap into the third layer and make the nuns, the specific adaptive immune system rapidly active. Even a
Stir, something comes in, so it's both preventive. But is also, when you feel you become six. So a an Invader has gotten in then you are still a very able to restore the balance within
got it. Yes. And the if we're looking at the, the explanation that the scientists have at this point, for your
Ability and your subjects ability to protect themselves or Shield themselves, it seemed like one hypothesis was you being able to increase? I think noradrenaline or norepinephrine levels in the body. Do you agree with that or do you think there are other? Do you have other theories? I do I do. I'd love to hear not,
it's like if you have HIV and then the immune system is still looking for answers.
Up till a moment that it is not able to specify any more what's going on and then we get AIDS and that means that all the defense systems are shut down. Now we have shown by norepinephrine and no adrenaline adrenaline that we can serve press. The inflammation. That means the flam ettore bodies and creating an immune response and
We suppress it. That would be like shutting down the immune system that makes us following. The scientific logic that makes us more vulnerable, know what we do. And they still got to find out, but I just use my natural logic and you can read about in the, in the, in the, in the papers that we have found.
A way to awaken the third line, which normally takes weeks or months to to find the specific hormone or molecule, which then is going for the Target cell to go on the membrane and to kill the cell.
So, that's interesting. It's almost like internal drug development, you're trying to find the lock that. I'm sorry. The key that fits the proper lock, but you're doing it internally.
Yeah, it normally takes a very long time biologically to yep to to sort of a conclude with but you're accelerating that process.
Exactly. And then they hormones are not needed anymore because the specific hormone their specific molecule gets on the cell membrane and then all this, like fire people, which is NORAD really gets throughout the system and
Different as well. And they suppress the inflammation, the action and that is only possible when the the target is already an Ayah lated when the target has a specific molecule on it because of the third line of defense, right? And that that that's what we found. We found a way and it's also good dr. Kevin Tracy from Manhasset New York who tells them he is very
much. He's an authority in the biochemistry and I worked with him in 2007 and I showed I was able in his Institute to suppress or to influence the vague nerve which
is the vagus nerve. Yeah. Yes. And
now, he told in nature, he told immunity does not come.
Without neural regulation, they found a way.
So what do you doubt? For instance. I was, I did my undergraduate for a very short period of time in college, I studied neuroscience. And I remember when I was in college, there is a professor there, who determined that, for instance, the neurons in, the hippocampus could actually be regenerated and this was very, very big, big news, because people had assumed for a very long time.
In a number of parts of the brain that neurons could not be degenerated or regenerated. Basically, as you got older you just lost neuronal function and it could not be restored. Now we know that's not true, right? And so you're having this a similar experience where you are proving to people, that things are possible that were thought impossible. What what do you think? What other Impossibles do you think we will prove are possible in the next? Say five years in your kind of area of experimentation
Very, very nice thought and a very good question. I think a, a depression for example, and the brains itself, we are able to tap into the brains and do so much more influence so much more and which is related to the hypothalamus and the pineal gland, pituitary gland the hippocampus and the amygdala, the seed of emotion all these
Our part and around with the brain stem, which is The Reptilian Brain, the Primitive brain and because of our comfort way of living and behavior. This part doesn't get enough
stimulation. Wait, what were untrained?
Yes, it doesn't get the stimulation or oxygen. So there is a certain kind of deregulating pH
Bill, we are going on. It's just to a lack of oxygen. There is no action, no stimulation. So, in time, it begins to malfunction and that's, yeah, that's actually, yeah. Sort of a logic. So we suffer from a whole lot, for example, of depression, in the western world because because we go too much into the neocortex, The Superficial brain, the new
Brain and we have to do all kinds of things and that that lines and worries and we cannot stop it. And it consumes all the energy, what I do and learn is to go into the brain stem. Again, this is the Simplicity of our Reptilian Brain, the Primitive brain, the brain stem, which is related, to all these beautiful glance over there, which is the pineal gland pituitary gland.
And the controller of ours, which is the hypothalamus, right? And the seed of emotion itself, which is the amygdala and it's older. And so I found a way to get into that. And show just by this example of hours, to lying in bed, people are able to produce more adrenaline than
Buddy, who is in fear going into a bungee jump for the first time, you see what I mean? Right, that means fear emotion, uncontrollable emotions and fear, we are able to control that and that's because we tap controlled into the brain, stem and produce, any adrenaline or epinephrine, or all these. All these
Gland. No, not glance of hormones. We need and it's the pineal gland in the finally, which is the control of all the other glands in our body. So, we are able now to tap into that. So, the coming five years, I want to eradicate, depression, I want to rewrite the gate, the yeah, actually, the disease. I know that a big words, but we are into that.
I'm not only into that is are also professors biochemists stamp my point and they see it's so simple, so accessible and so effective. But it needs to be translated into our infrastructure of thinking as well as of interests repeats to cooperate with schooling. Now, we got on the University, that's nice. It's coming top down because I'll if they you
As universities are taking it on then soon, all the universities in the world will follow. So we find okay. I rest my point for
now, and we are here with, for instance, depression. So there, I'm sure there are a lot of people listening who have bouts with depression or even extended depression.
Yes, no. Control over their mood, right? That's no control over the brain stamp, right? So, let's bring it back.
To the
brainstem, right? So for instance, you know, I find that it's very helpful, for me, at least, to use cold exposure and whether that's cold, showers or ice bath. It has a tremendous mood elevating effect or maybe mood exactly balancing effect a depending on how we want to explain it. But for someone who is feeling depressed, what are some simple things that you would recommend that they try
potentially?
First, get into conscious breathing.
Deeper breathing and be consciously doing that it showed in the University that I was able just, you know, about Consciousness just by thinking that I was going into an experiment. I raised cell on Cell level, they, it is metabolic activity in the cell with 300%.
Just by thinking, that's our mind. So our mind should be with people who are depressed. They just got lost, they have no control. So they have to regain control by consciously. Going into breathing, breathing brings about deeper breathing. Brings about a better pH level in the body, but not only in the body. Also in the mind and the
The right pH level will make the neurotransmitters that your mind, the electrical signals, finally, work better, and then you are able to do learn to direct these neurotransmitters or thoughts. The Mind itself consciously with the right pH degree. So we make it simple. We say conscious breathing,
All the time because you lost track and it takes energy takes your mind and it you got to bring back your mind under your control.
And I mean, this I think is related to a broader topic of compulsive Behavior, right? Or people who have automatic behaviors that are not serving them. And one of those is oftentimes eating or overeating and before we started recording, you know, I asked you what you had for breakfast
At nothing because you eat once per day. So I could you describe what your daily eating ritual is
I eat after 6 o'clock in the afternoon and that's already for 35 years and there is I got a lot of energy and you know why? You have a lot of allergies now a
nerd. Oh, I'm sorry, sorry, got it
baby allergies as well, women, you know,
Okay. Just make fun. You
know I think you and I have to have wine next time we do. This
is very healthy, very good. The thing is by better breathing conscious breathing. You make this chemical process in the in the cell happen, which is called aerobic dissimulation. And as you know, in the cell production,
Energy mitochondrial energy, you need food. But if you are able to influence by better, breathing a deeper breathing, then you produce simple metabolic activity in the mitochondria by better breathing, and that creates energy, which was the purpose of food. So, food is nice. Hello, I'm here. Oh yeah, food is nice food.
That's great. You should do it with a lot of love and they're having a nice time making it and the because that's the energy you get finally alter. But, like me if I like, it's a sort of a fast, but I have to feel your ear, the Santa's really get our going to be much more effective, and the cell activity is going to be much more effective, and it is you
Using all the food you can eat after 6 o'clock. I can eat what I want the other day. I'm slim again and that's making, you know, we're making the Bodywork but as we eat all the day long, the body is not shutting down is not effective anymore. Doesn't go deep doesn't go into survival mode. Has it's not natural again. So it's beginning to store up all the fats because it doesn't know what to do.
Do anymore because the deeper mechanisms are not working animal though. Yeah. And what I do to bring that
and what do you usually, what it? What are some typical meals that you have after 6:00 p.m.
that's I like pasta.
Yeah.
And I like a couple of beers to
and yeah, sounds good. I eating rituals are interesting. I've interviewed a number of people on this podcast.
General Stanley. McChrystal is a four-star general and he was. He's also famous for getting a lot of exercise early in the day and eating one meal per day. He's also, he's also very well known for that. You, you described the breathing exercise, some of the breathing exercises that you do. It does the type of breathing that you do have anything is it similar in any ways to holotropic breathwork if you're familiar?
With that. And I heard from someone and maybe you can correct me if I'm wrong that some scientists had looked at whether you were producing or releasing more DMT during some of your breathing activities is that accurate or did I get some misinformation from someone? Just be
very well. That's a professor. Oh, right? Yeah, I don't know. I collaborate. Oh, I don't know where. What is his name again? I do. Ray is a Authority in the field.
But I had a dialogue with him and he is talking about all these, you know, Ayahuasca and all
these drugs and all this and
experimenting. And I said, I told him I'm able to produce to trigger the pineal gland in a way that DMT is released. And and yes can make people very, very happy doing.
We know all these breathing exercises, that's true. But the purpose of DMT actually, is to work out the subconscious while dreaming in the rapid eye movement sleep. And the other one is when you die, then DMT is released as well as to make it more General. Happy grown after having a have a nice time, go to the other side, something like that. So there is a natural purpose.
For DMT but we are. We are very, I'm very able to trigger that that creates DMT and I told him and I told him altar, it's not only about the DMT, which is very nice, it's a nice drug and all that. But the better part of it is if we are able to to trigger the pineal gland, which is related directly to the
hypothalamus and
the pituitary gland.
If we are able to trigger that one and to decalcify because of our comfort way of living the this pineal gland. Then this gland is able to to direct all the other glands, it's the only gland that is directing all the other glands and we can bring. We can Nur Ali connect with it without our neocortex, is what we do. And it shows
Is down that we are able to prevent from disease or bacteria coming because we are able to activate it much more directly. And that's the main purpose is to, you know, for looking different at what creates disease. It's because of our pineal gland, or the brainstem is not really active anymore, because it's neglected because of comfort Style.
Of living and behavior. And we want to make a shortcut and to show it that it is simple accessible ineffective.
Well, I think that the, the, the comfort is important to underscore because I was having a conversation with Dean karnazes several years ago, he's a famous ultra-marathoner. You guys would probably have a lot to talk about and he he ran need a 50 marathons in 50 days in 50 states. He's one of those guys and he said that,
He lives in Northern California near San Francisco where I live and he and one of his lines and I'm, I might be paraphrasing this, but he said, you know, people now, they confuse being happy with being comfortable and they think being comfortable, these is being happy, but that those are not the same thing and I'd like to talk about discomfort for a second. So you ran a marathon in? Was it Death Valley with no water?
Yes, I think like that. Yeah. And that may be a
Not
in Namibia. That's right. Even so you that is even more dangerous because you have snakes and whatnot so is it possible to not? So of course when you are submerged in ice, it's been demonstrated that you can maintain your core body temperature for a very long period of time. Is it possible for you to drop your body temperature in a hot climate? Or if you just is it training yourself to withstand the higher
temperatures?
Yes, exactly. Both actually, your tolerance is rising. And that means you're able to endure a whole lot more because you are able to influence their hormonal system. In a way that neutralizes pain signals, that's one the other one is because of my training in the cold, I not only trained in the cold, I trained to endure impact.
Of temperature, and those are receptors of ours, which I have trade. And then because of that, which is part of which is controlled by the hypothalamus, is the thermal regulator of our body. And because I trained in the cold, I trained the thermal regulation of the body, then without trading without training, a meter of running and then not drinking.
A full marathon in the Namib Desert in the eat without prior training or other been there before, I was very able to do that because this thermal regulative mechanism, the hypothalamus, I had trained in, in, in the coal, which is the temperature impact. So, I learned to deal with the temperature and you know what, and not only the temperature, which is called
Heat but also deprivation of oxygen that means going up. No Mount Everest in short. That means there's a very cold out there. There is no oxygen and you need oxygen to for combustion in the in the cell to create heat energy and there is no oxygen. So I learned in the cold how to deal with impact.
On the bone nervous system on our metabolism, that means called deprivation of oxygen heat, but also stress daily stress. So the secret of our comfort, as you say, and the people that they are confusing like the paraphrasing. This this this great guy of Northern California who is telling the truth. We are confused, we don't know anymore.
Real confident is real. Conflict is the power to regulate all the impact existence in in life, that means disease, which is impact on our body, heat, cold, deprivation of oxygen stress in general, any stress, and we are able to control that a whole lot more. And that brings about the real Comfort. Because if you
Back to yourself with all these older systems within then, you feel really good. Real good is real connection and that, that, that something be a gonna be. That's why all these outdoor Freaks and the idiots and Etc, like myself doing this because we just feel
good. Well, seems like it's also feeling Comfort is in a way becoming
confident in discomfort, right? So you, you have a confidence that you can handle and adapt to whatever is going to come your way much. Like some of the suppose Elite military that I've met, who are or very, actually very relaxed. I mean, the most, most of the high-level guys, I've met because they've systematically exposed themselves to discomfort, so they don't fear discomfort if that makes sense. Exactly,
they control their stress hormone release, completely,
That's what I'm talking
about. Now, you speak. How many languages do you speak 10:10? That is a lot of languages. How did you learn that? Many languages
just be open and love to learn and that's it. I have no real teachers, then you know, people in the street and sometimes I had to look for a teacher, like a Japanese teacher door here and a hamster.
Damn and the Hindu teacher Pandit and so yeah, I was just interested. If you are interested in life you get to know and you never stop learning because you love
it. It's there is what language of all the languages you've tried. What was the hardest for you?
The hardest maybe Polish Polish because it's a completely different set of grammatical
structures. I see polish and Nostrovia I guess I have I bet you know that one.
Yeah, yeah yeah. Of course
we definitely have to have a round two with some with some wine and beer but the the next question I'd love to ask is perhaps a simple one, but
Why are people fat and how can people develop more Brown fat and use it? Effectively?
Yes, it but not being fat because it's a protective mechanism of the, our bodies. It's actually an answer to do on too much impact, too much wrong. Chemistry going on. So, it wants to make an installation. That's a, that's a natural thing to do of the body. Now,
Now we are suffering from that. Now it's called obesity and being overweight and we have no control just bring them back to the control. How do we do that? Bye-bye, this adipose Brown fat, adipose because they have a mostly of those people have also an absence of brown fat because they have no stimulation anymore for longer time and then this insulation reflex
Beginning to build up and build up. But actually this telling, hey, guy, I'm trying to do my best for you, but you are not doing anything in return. And as long as you're not triggering, or stimulating the adipose, the brown fat, then it it sir, comes the, it goes away and, and, and then it is not able to to, to divert white fat into energy.
Gigi anymore, right? So it's gone with people with obesity. They have no Brown fat anymore. So, there is a logic explanation to it and I know it. So they have to bring a
bag and is that hold exposure, primarily they would be the first step to try to
hold cold exposure, not a natural exposure to the elements that's one in and ab depth of way, gradual way, I mean that we are able to adapt to it but as these mechanisms,
Sound out working really well within these people. So they have to be very, you know, it's sensitive and and gradual going into it and breathing breathing is chemistry's. Chemica is influencing the chemistry right here, right now. Better breathing deep breathing brings about a better PhD degree in the body. Which then finally
Results in the faster
metabolism. And if people are practicing, this are want to pack practices breathing on their own. Is there any particular Mantra or anything? They should focus on or say to themselves as they're doing this is any type of meditation, okay? To start with like using an app like headspace or calm, or do you have a particular recommendation? If someone said I have 10 minutes a day, I'm willing to spend doing this. What would you say to them?
Yeah. Just have your favorite music going on. Go really
To it and go really into the breathing because it's about chemical changes. And whenever you hear the right music, you are able to relax more and more oxygen than is able to get into the body, which is finally changing the the pH levels in the body to the to its natural state. That's what we have because we live in such a, you know, Gary compressed Society. I
Too much stress going on. We do not have control over the stress. We get out of our Natural State. So, within 10 minutes, we are, I say within 4 minutes. Just do this breathing exercise, which I teach people and do push-ups push-ups without air in the
lungs. You should do that. So, you see, do that after the, after the
exhale?
Yes, after the at first, you do like 30, like I explained deeply within let go deeply with him. Look at the indications for feeling loose in the body, and lightheaded contractions, a little bit tingly, and that's all okay. Like 30 or 40, deep breaths, and then Letting Go 40 times, then you will arrive, you adapt to being charged with art.
June. And the CO2 carbon dioxide Got Away pH level is gotten up. Then you shoot breathing fully letting go after exhalation you stop and you go do push-ups and you will see you are able to do more push-ups without in the lungs because you influence into the chemistry
then and probably a good idea to do on a soft surface first. Yeah, just in case you decide to kiss the floor a little too.
Too hard. Now, this is something that that layered and his guys have been working on as well. I mean, a lot of these guys are working and doing push-ups or stationary bike, very interesting. They have freedivers that sometimes work out with is very fascinating great. Well, I'm going to try that. I would love to switch gears just a little bit and ask you a couple of Rapid questions. You can. Certainly take your time, doesn't mean you have to answer them quickly. But the first is when you think of the word successful, who is
First person who comes to mind for
you.
The heart in any person,
the
heart, the heart, in any person. That that that that success. Yeah. Further, maybe Mandela
Nelson Mandela. Yes. And in with the heart, if someone feels like, if someone doesn't feel successful, what would you? What would your advice be to them? Or what would you, what would you say to them?
Yeah, just do the method. I mean, this method is showing scientifically to be able to tap into the deepest of our physiology. If somebody feels he's frustrated is because he is not able to tap in his or hers physiology
At the deepest, he has no control, that makes people frustrated. And we, we mirror that with society and all that, but you got your vehicle. If you are able to steal your vehicle, your body, your mind to work through, whatever you feel, then you will be successful in any proof.
Yes, I'm sorry to interrupt. I was just going to ask why Nelson Mandela,
he's just a good guy. He was always.
Smiling. He loved the women
and
he States like, 25 years believing in this case, right? And that makes him for me, really strong. And I love people who have faith, simply because that's what they feel. And, yes, I have. I've been so many years, neglected and mocked marked and all that, but I always had my faith. And now,
It is. So thanks for the same like 20 years ago. They told me you're crazy. You're an idiot, you're a lunatic and all that. Yes. And even my in my family I was the black sheep and right now I'm the widest ship ever. So it's a lot of hypocrisy going on in the world because people do not know. But I got my faith. I got my belief and I want to go up to the point that
We scientifically showed everybody is able to tap in. It's a endocrine system so much that, depression, and being unhappy. And being frustrated is no longer part of humanity. It's a choice.
Now this is a, this is a topic. I be, I think we could talk about for a long time. What is your favorite book or the book that you've given to other people? The most is a
gift.
Whoa, never gave so many books, except for the books out
writing, right? What do you give to people as gifts? What do you like, give people as
gifts. Oh, as Stones Stones a lot of certain natural things, I get people natural things, I collected a whole bunch of things, and then two months later, I'm fed up with the thing. And then, I think this one wants to go with you and knows that beautiful stones.
Now you told them the first time, I thought, wow, great Stone, beautiful, this artifact. Well, what grade? Wow, nice than two months later and say, yeah, it's gone. And then I just gave it away at. So with books the same thing as c, dr. C data. And Jonathan Livingston Seagull comes to my mind. That's okay. And some scriptures, I read about the bhagavad-gita.
Cheetah and the Bible, of course, about all these books. I was reading hundreds of books and at a certain point, I could not make the connection with my, the deepest Within Myself, which was the Seeker. I was sold to Richard and I found it finally in the open book of the Ice Water, because the ice water is merciless but righteous it bring to you.
Within. And there is no, there is no chit chatting around. That is no philosophy. You just do it right? Or you do wrong
now you've had, of course, some, some very challenging times perhaps more so than many people I've spoken with, you had a very tragic, premature death it with your wife, in the case your wife, what do
Do you do to to overcome those dark periods?
Yes. Very very good, very interesting. Very real and deep gone. And losing the person. You love. I have for children with her. They work with me right now. They are like 33 years old. All this one
and then two daughters and another
son and they all work with me right now, okay?
To E1 is working right now at the Dutch Embassy in Washington, DC in America. But the rest is working with me all the tap. So losing the love of your life. How deep can you go and being teared apart? That was what I was experiencing at the time but then I was the only person who was who
I was alone and I had to raise four kids alone and that they were like 7 years. They are old age years, nine years, and 11 years, and had to raise them alone. So, I received so much love of of my kids, and I did my training. And as I told you the, the brainstem is also, the area of the seat of emotion, which is the amygdala.
and because of this training and the cold, I could control silence myself and go on and always find the energy to go on and to be a father, happy and exercising and practical and with my kids and they gave me a lot of love but
The thing about grief and the emotion is, you have to go deep because emotion is going deep. And as we live in the comfort zone, we have no control mostly over emotion. And I tell you, there is a way to control the seat of emotion, which is the amygdala connected to the, in the area of the brain stem. So, I think this not think my experience tells me,
Discipline discipline and believing believing with in there is a weight to silence grieved broken hearts, grief and pain and hurt emotions.
Yes it's a it's a way I did it and the it's really been fascinating for me to observe a number of people. I won't mention some of the other names but who have used specifically
Exposure to the cold too, suppose the purity of that cold and the attention that requires sort of purity of attention, that it requires to overcome very dark periods or be it to act as a very strong component for passing through those difficult periods. It's just it's a very yes fascinating pattern that I've observed in a number of my number of my friends, I recognize it. What is what is your morning? The first 60 Minutes of your day? Look like, when do you
Wake up. What do you do in those first 60 minutes? If you have complete control over that morning.
First, I begin to conscious breathing, we're consciously
breathe. When you wake up, yes. And
your life is all about vital force created by oxygen. Just, it's for free, and it's there. And I said, it's to me, it's okay, it's God itself. They like Paloma the
vital for any
T, the product. It's all a different name.
Names of God and they tell all the belief systems, tell that that's the vital force of any, yeah, of life itself. So that's the, that's a very logic natural way. I begin to Just
Breathe. Still, they still laying in bed.
Yeah, still laying on that. And that to doing the exercise, which I explained bright.
In this interview is, yeah, it is very nice because you are still very relaxed and about the body is without tension. So you then are able to go tap deeply into the system
and how long will you do that in bed, typically? Yeah so stay
a half hour, something like that before I'm going into action could be an hour because it's
Never never
boring. What would you say to someone? Who says, you know, actually I find it really boring. I'm not saying that I feel that way, but if you have no, I got if someone felt boring. What would you, what would you advise them, or? What would you tell them?
It's once again, the same thing as this Californian. Great guy. He
took the Incarnate. Yeah, the income
asset and they don't know what Comfort is all about. So it going deep just by breathing
Into the depth of our physiology is like gaining. The aim of all those people going into outdoor or taking drugs or doing extremes or go for a rush. Now you can are able to learn to control the depth of your physiology by just breathing properly and going into that system. And boring is something if you.
You are doing things repetitiously, but not breaking through the conditioning, and I learned people to go through the
conditioning, right? So if you have to be conscious about the activity, you can't be daydreaming. Well, it seems you just have to be attentive to your breathing when you're doing something like
this. Yes, yes, yes. Just go into it. It's like the pastner meditation. That's what they do, you know, and they sit. And they just listen. And
Focus on breathing. That's all at what I do. And they get into a deeper layer of their brain because they are not giving their focus to something else than just mayor breathing. It is so simple. But so effective.
I'll try that tomorrow morning. The so let's say you do that for a half hour. Then what do you do for the next half hour
nowadays? I do a lot too.
Do a lot of workshops and lectures
and I'm
into science. But yeah, for a in between, I do exercising. I like
exercising, what type of exercise do you? If you had to choose one type of exercise or two types of exercise for yourself? What would you choose strength and flexibility? What would you do for both of those
strengths? For example, stay on two arms, say four minutes.
Like a plank or just different types of poses on two arms. Yeah,
with one end or to a plank or handstands or pull-ups push-ups. Of course, those are, you know, power exercises, or stand-in or stands for an hour that is sometimes just to with stones in my hands and make all kinds of Kung-Fu like movements. Just
Make them
up. And
but you know, do better. My acidic the aesthetic processes in my body. So, I go deeply into the horse stance and breathe in a way that a asset is not developing in the body. So, that makes me control the body and it feels good and then for flexibility. Yeah. All kinds of splits and put a couple of legs in Maya behind my head.
See,
you don't do
balancing exercises. It's nice. So I I maintain the body that way.
What do you listen to music when you're exercising, or do you do it without music?
All right, I simply have no record system, so, but in right now, I'm we bought a center. So I will have my big dojo and whoa, Cascade and all that. And it's
Swimming pool and all those things and that I will have the right music and make music myself. I play the guitar, I sing I want to make a CD very soon. And people like me, singing doing all kinds of mantras because I, you know, learnt about the Sanskrit and and Spanish songs in English songs and all kinds of songs. I just make up with sort of a rapper too, so,
Yeah, I'd love to hear it. And what What musician do you look up to the most? Is there a particular musician that you admit that you would like to emulate or look up to like a lot of
Lounge? Easy music. I like Michael Jackson,
Michael Jackson's, great. Yeah, yeah. He is super fit. Give a favorite song or favorite
album of Michael Jackson? Yes, ma'am. Yeah, I've all the songs.
This is it, for example, it's a guerrilla. Oh yeah, great drill is great. And his voice is messed
merrik. Oh yeah,
totally, yes. So I get my son his name, which is Michael, which is one of my sons so things like that, but also Pink, Floyd also Gipsy Kings, you know, the Flamingo and all the good music and there's a
Of good music going on. And
yes, I can't wait to visit the center. Is that going to be in Holland?
Yes. Okay, for now, it's in Holland. I was looking at to make a center in near San Francisco as well. I got some very good friends over
there. You should. You should, you should come out. Maybe we'll do a workshop and I can introduce you to. I'll invite Dean as well, you could meet Dean. Yes, yes, he's a great guy, he's a great guy. He would look I he would love to meet you, I'm sure
The just a few more questions. I want to be obviously respectful of your time. What, what purchase in the last you know, six months or a year of less than $100. So something you bought for less than $100 has most positively impacted your life Stones Stones. I love these Stones. I want to talk about says so. So how do you find these stones and what makes you pick one? Do you have any favorites?
I always think stones out at whatever touches Matt meets.
Yeah, I II take them from the mountains. I climbed but I also like this new amethyst sand old pails and all kinds of, you know, beautiful stones with the beautiful colors like that. But yeah, always take stones from the I just found a big for sale in the in the Spanish Pyrenees, you know, bake bake means like to
Three kilos.
That's a big that's a big big bottle there.
Yeah, for style. And and I couldn't get it down because I was there with a group that at at no backpack I had to carry the, the
ropes because we were doing Canyon well, that
so but there was a girl from Austin, Texas, Austin Elizabeth Lee and she had a backpack and she she carried it.
It's a good friend.
Yeah. Oh yeah. I love
her so much. Yeah. So, the, what effect do and did you do put that in your kitchen? Where do you put such a such a stone and what effect does it have on you,
everywhere? They, they have a solid effect. They simply there and they are beautiful and I always pass them on to other people except for the big ones.
What?
But what advice would you give your 30 year old self?
My 30th and just have faith? Just have faith faith? Yes.
That then that what? What type of faith that things will work out? The things will be. Okay.
Say it is simple. Logic have simple logic and understand the things simply and listen to you feeling. Mmm. Listen to your feeling you're feeling. It knows, is it is
Lee sense-making. And that if you are letting it in your way of thinking, then never lose track of whatever makes sense, which is feeling, which is Instinct and
intuition, right? Right. This is something, I've been trying to work on a lot because it's easy for me, at least to get trapped in my neocortex to get trapped. Exactly in the front of my brain where I can make pro and con lists, but
The answer is so obvious sometimes because, you know that something's wrong, are you know, that someone isn't a good fit or you don't trust someone just like, you have that feeling like a dog where you immediately act like, or dislike something. Yes. It's been. The trying to train myself to go back to that Simplicity. It's making sense. It can be challenging out the suits one, or two more questions. The if you could have one billboard one, huge sign anywhere with anything on it.
Would it say and where would you put
it? I would say brief motherfucker.
So you could put that on like a busy highway can put that on like Sunset Boulevard in Los Angeles, or
maybe I breathe. I'm ready. I don't know why they way they understand it, but it's really meant lovable he, right? And you know, which strength it is the answer.
Sir, to the up till the DNA itself. And it's not me telling that anymore because of the blood results, professors have confirmed that we are in the middle of DNA and what is the trigger breathing.
So, this is, you could, you could have it's a breathe breathe mother fucker with then. A smiley, a smiley face like a smiley emoticon. That'd be perfect.
Yeah. So, we got a t-shirt that says in the front, please.
You know, it's about the cold it and that the other side is read
motherfucker. Well, you and I need to hang out more. I this has been great. Of course everybody listening, I'm going to put tons of links in the show notes. You should check out Iceman Wim Hof, W IM Hof, definitely check out women Hof method and I'll link to that in the show notes which is a 10-week online video course which
Such a bunch of people whose names you would know are are using right now to very, very interesting and their bunch of documentaries and links to the textbooks. I will include as well. Women do you have any last requests or asks of my audience? There are a lot of people who will be hearing this. If you could ask them all to do something besides check out the courses and so on. What would you ask them to do something? They could do when they hear this or after they hear it?
Yeah, just pass on breathe, that's one and take a cold shower after a hot work and it just get into the signs of this, all it is non-speculative. And for the rest, I just love you
guys. Well, when this is wonderful, everybody, listening, I will link to all these things. You can find whim on Twitter at Iceman underscore Hof Hof, and I'll link to that Instagram. Same Iceman.
Underscore Hoff Facebook is facebook.com forward slash becoming the Iceman and whim, thank you so much for taking the time. This was a blast.
Thank you very much. I hear a soul, mate. I thank you very much. I love you very much. Greetings, to Ray. Krone has definitely talk to him. Be, I will mail. And also he loves you and he loves your work. He loves my work. You know, we like to work, too.
Make love
happen, definitely. Well, we will play some guitar and have some wine and you can, oh yeah, I would love to. I would love to get into some shorts and freeze my ass off and breathe. At some point, I do up in right up in the mountains, I would be. That'd be great. So, until next time, thank you, everybody for listening, and when thanks so much. Great, thank you very much, too. Hey guys, this is Tim again just a few more things before you take.
Off number one, this is five bullet Friday. Do you want to get a short email from me and would you enjoy getting a short email for me every Friday. That provides a little more soul of fun before the weekend, and five bullet Friday is a very short email where I share the coolest things I've found or that I've been pondering over the week that could include favorite new albums that I've discovered it could include gizmos and gadgets and all sorts of weird shit that I've somehow dug up in the the world of the esoteric.
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